Clutch slave mounting bolt broke!

[texas-ss-tornado]

Boy, I'm pooched now! Was installing a new slave cylinder into my 85 VMAX, and POOF! One of the two allen screws that holds it on just decided to SNAP! After cussing like a sailor for about 5 minutes, now I have to figure out how to get it out. It's the top bolt, and there is NOTHING left sticking out of the hole, it's probably recessed 1/16 inch with what is left of it. The problem is, there's no room to really work or get anything inside their to try and drill it, or use an easy out to get to it. Any ideas guys or am I just totalled screwed????

 

[SpecOps13]

Wow Bro, I really feel for you. Gonna take someone with more knowledge than me to help you here. Sounds like the kind of things that happen to me....:bang head:

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

Well, make that DOUBLE POOCHED! Went and got an easy out, had a nice little hold started, got the easy out in there, and POOF! You guessed it! The easy out broke too. This bike is haunted, and I'm THIS close to parting it out! I don't even know if second gear is good yet, that's the only reason I've gone this far. Got it running, bled the clutch and realized the slave was bad. Went to put the new one on and CABOOM! More problems than I think it's worth. What a friggin' nightmare!!!!!

 

[one2dmax]

Bummer. Not sure what we would do to fix it without it here to look at. Post up a picture of the horror.

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

Here you go Sean, for what it's worth, really hard to get a good picture in there. I actually started the bike and let it warm up this morning, hoping maybe the heat would help coax it out, not a chance. I'm at my wits end. The real problem is it's almost impossible to get a drill bit in there, I found some "hex head" extension drill bits, but they are not very strong and I've already broken 2 of them. Any suggests that don't involve dynomite???? :damn angry:

 

[one2dmax]

I've got a few bits that would probably get in there (I have a small selection of 12" long bits). I also have some tight access bits and 90 drives that are for tight access. It's going to suck either way to get out. I need to try and remember to look while I am at the shop to see what we'd do.

Sean

 

[bazwell]

Oh crap. What a predicament.

I would have tried a left hand drill bit, but I think that's not much use now.

I don't know if someone with a metal disintegrator will be able to get in to there. http://www.google.com.au/search?q=m...ox&ie=&oe=&redir_esc=&ei=wnsTT_C7EKyziQfO5Kgw

It will go through the ezy out, no problem. Even then, you would still need to cut a thread. Shit.

Lot's of patience required!

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

Oh crap. What a predicament.

I would have tried a left hand drill bit, but I think that's not much use now.

I don't know if someone with a metal disintegrator will be able to get in to there. http://www.google.com.au/search?q=m...ox&ie=&oe=&redir_esc=&ei=wnsTT_C7EKyziQfO5Kgw

It will go through the ezy out, no problem. Even then, you would still need to cut a thread. Shit.

Lot's of patience required!

Couldn't find a left hand drill bit long enough to get in there. The "metal disintegrator" is not going to fit down in there either, not alot of room to work with unless I decide to REMOVE THE MOTOR! I have basically given up for now, I've found some longer cobalt bits, I may try to just drill all the way through it. If I damage the threads, I guess a heli-coil will be in order. What a friggin' PITA, I may just give up and part out the damn thing. If I get this fixed and THEN find out second gear is toast, I'm really going to hate myself!

 

[bazwell]

You just made me think of how I got a drill in there to remove the seal.
One of these things, with a hex drive extension.
It was a bit of a pain with the chuck wobbling in the hex drive, but maybe the right size tube could be made into a fixed extension which would be better.

I think my toolbox needs one of those!
I can feel my brain trying to think... ow

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

I've been using hex drive bits to have enough length to even get in there. With a hex bit, they even make extensions that give me more than enough length to do it. The problem is, they don't make a left handed drill bit with a hex, at least I couldn't find one at 3 different stores, and the "easy out" was not able to attach to anything but a socket, so I whacked it in there, got it started, and POOF. It snapped in two. I think I've drilled enough past the easy out that I'm back to just bolt, but I've got a long way to go to get to the end of it, and if I do, what happens to the remains of the bolt? What does it fall into? What a F'in nightmare over one stupid bolt. :damn angry:

 

[Fire-medic]

OK, I am not sure about the case thickness at that point. How about using either a large drill bit or a coring bit to remove the entire area & then either tapping it for a helicoil which you put in-place, & then install a drilled, threaded bolt for the size you need? The bolt will have the thread size you need for the slave cyl, I am guessing M6/1.0? Of course you drill & tap the bolt which goes into the helicoil before you install it.

I saw my friend do this on a KZ1000 case, he used a NPT plug to replace the area where the fastener was bad & then drilled/tapped the NPT plug and it worked out great. He used grease on the drill bit to catch any metal shavings he could & some used atf to rinse out the engine after he drained the oil too.

 

[sdt354]

That's a tough one. I'm going to go out and see how much clearance there is with the engine in place. To drill an easy out? Slow drill speed, good pressure, sharp drill(new is nice), cutting oil (30w and ATF mixed works), then cleaning and grease before you go through to catch filings is a great idea Fire-Med. You might want to drill a small pilot hole not quite all the way through. That sucks, but a tap is worse.
Steve

 

[bazwell]

I've been using hex drive bits to have enough length to even get in there. With a hex bit, they even make extensions that give me more than enough length to do it. The problem is, they don't make a left handed drill bit with a hex, at least I couldn't find one at 3 different stores, and the "easy out" was not able to attach to anything but a socket, so I whacked it in there, got it started, and POOF. It snapped in two. I think I've drilled enough past the easy out that I'm back to just bolt, but I've got a long way to go to get to the end of it, and if I do, what happens to the remains of the bolt? What does it fall into? What a F'in nightmare over one stupid bolt. :damn angry:

Sounds like you are doing quite well actually! It is a nightmare alright, but given that you have the ezy-out drilled, you are doing very well.

In a workshop I worked in we would often get people with broken ezy-outs that they couldn't remove. You are miles ahead of most people! I'm of the opinion that ezy outs are a fallacy designed by clever manufacturers to create more work for engineering shops! My personal little crazy conspiracy theory. :biglaugh:

You've got some good advice here already. Another similar idea to what was proposed above are Keenserts (key-inserts) which come ready made similar to what Firemedic was suggesting. A thicker walled thread insert. Heres the first link I found - http://mdmetric.com/prod/insert/keenserts.htm

The little hex drive chuck I put a picture of can take a left handed bit, and they only cost a couple of dollars.

Good luck mate!

 

[hubeerjw]

This is just an idea, but could you get a wire welder in there and weld on to the top of the bolt? The heat alone might be enough to help free it up. Probably not going to be able to get in there, but another option.

Jeff

 

[thundermax]

I really feel bad about your ordeal, ever since I first read it.

Today I thought wouldn't it be great if a Yamaha Vmax engineer studied the problem and made a good suggestion. They would know thickness, everything related to this portion of the motor.

No there is not a money tree in me backyard either. But it would be great if corporate Yamaha came up with a great solution.

I am thinking how it relates to Microsoft Engineers helping/being on some software forums and making suggestions.

Just an idea.

 

[Fire-medic]

Smeone w/a bare case should be able to give us a fair approximation of wall thickness of the casting. I suppose another method would be to build the area of the removed fastener up w/weld & then machine it down while you removed a similar amount off the mounting point of the slave cyl, not having one of these in-front of me I dunno if this is feasable, but it may be a possibility. Or, take a dimensional piece of AL & weld it in-place, again removing a corresponding amount from the slave cyl mounting webbing (assuming you remove the broken stub & need to get some more material in there to make the fastener work).

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

Well, I hate to give up, but as luck would have it, a 97 VMAX just popped up on the Dallas Craigslist last night for 700 bucks!!! According to the owner, just needs carb work, only been off the road a couple years? Mileage in the low 20's? Hmmmm. I've got a brand new set of nice rebuilt carbs, sitting on the 85 with the busted slave bolt. Here's the other caveat, the 85 didn't come with a title, I can get one, but it's time consuming and sometimes a hassle. Going to go get the 97 tonight and see if I can get her going, if so, the 85 will make a nice parts bike. Stay tuned.

 

[Blurr]

Nice Shot , Oswald!!

That's some amazing luck.

 

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If you already have the easy out removed (sounds like you do) I would try using a left hand tap and buy a corresponding bolt for the tap. You can use a socket and extensions to drive the tap. I would heat the area before using the tap in hopes that it would drive the broken bolt out. If the tap does not, I would then try the left hand bolt. Also, I have had the best luck with screw extractors versus easy outs.

 

[texas-ss-tornado]

I've already tried the left hand tap, it just wouldn't grab onto anything. I've spent at least 12 hours trying to remove this friggin' bolt, I'm spent! I'm going to pick up that 97 VMAX tonight, try to get it running, and go from there. If the engine and tranny are solid, I'll be parting out the 85. Some must die so that others may live, it's not like I didn't try, but at some point, it's just time to admit defeat and move on. I think I've reached that point. Stay tuned.