Custom Radiator Anyone???

[RagingMain]

I am going to have a custom radiator built for my bike.
Just wondering if anyone else wanted to get it on this as well.
There is strength in numbers, lower prices.
Not sure on the price yet but I am guessing $300-$500, but that is probably high.
I am going to ship the guy an old radiator and have him make a more efficient one, same size and mounting tabs for OEM look.
Maybe 1" taller and little bit wider but for the most part the same.

Anyone...???

Cheers
Fargo

 

[Nicki66]

I have this custom one that I will let go real cheap. :biglaugh:

 

[RagingMain]

Thats perfect, I'll take it :rofl_200::biglaugh::eusa_dance:

 

[one2dmax]

LOL, very custom. Fargo, I've got a modified pump impeller I need someone to test. Want to give it a try and see if it works?

Sean

 

[RagingMain]

Sure Sean you know me. I am willing to try just about anything.:eusa_dance:
I assume, and we all know how that goes, this modified impeller is supposed to increase flow for more cooling???
If so send it this way, I am sure you have the address :rofl_200:
Might save me some cash
Cheers

 

[one2dmax]

Yea. Not sure what it's going to do but I think it will actually work better then the stock design. Very simple modification if it does actually work.

Sean

 

[RagingMain]

Yea. Not sure what it's going to do but I think it will actually work better then the stock design. Very simple modification if it does actually work.

Sean

cool

 

[RagingMain]

Hey Sean
Wait a few days before you send the impeller.
I am going to see if maybe it is my radiator by switching it out with the one I just picked up, on Marks old bike.
Here is the reason.

Going down the road I get about a 20* temp difference through the radiator, still hot though. Goes in about 240 and comes out 221.

Then when I let the bike sit a minute or two there is no cooling what so ever even with the fan running. I mean there should be some but the radiator inlet and outlet both read 240.

So I am going to see if there is a problem with the radiator or fan while stopped. If that doesnt solve the problem then I will have you ship out the impeller. More flow sitting still might help some but not much, at least I dont think so:ummm: Seems like I need more air flow.

 

[davidon]

What sensors are you using to read input/output temps?

 

[RagingMain]

What sensors are you using to read input/output temps?

My little laser gun on the inlet and outlet ports of the radiator

 

[one2dmax]

Already boxed up and easy to ship. Just add it to the parts pile so you can test with.
Sean

 

[RagingMain]

Sure then Sean, go ahead and send it.
Thanks

 

[RagingMain]

Sean sent me a modified water pump. Pretty easy to do. Removed half the vanes, 8 down to 4

Prelim results are good, but want to wait until it warms up bit to make a full report. It is going to be cool this week with possible showers but the weekend is warming up.

This seems to have an increase in fluid flow but since there are less vanes it wont make as much pressure

My observations were that it helped with cooling yet...
When stopped since there isnt as much pressure being made it seemed to boil over at a lower temp. So it might be a trade off.
Remember this was just a quick test and needs to be tested more thoroughly.
I will report back with more info when I have it.

 

[satariel666]

Well, thats intresting Fargo.
Never tought that way.

Most defo keep us posted.

 

[RagingMain]

Well, thats intresting Fargo.
Never tought that way.

Most defo keep us posted.

Well I am sure you know that the volute of the pump converts the velocity of the fluid from the impeller into pressure by gradually increasing the area.

Pressure and velocity are dependant on each other. I know I am going to stir up a big shit storm by saying this but it is absolutely true...
(I have a mechanical engineering degree, trust me)

When you put your finger over the end of a hose you are actually decreasing the pressure but increasing the velocity of the water leaving the hose.
The exact opposite is going on behind your thumb. The velocity is way down but the pressure is up.
Remember we are taking measurements at two different points.
P/V leaving the hose
P/V inside the hose

Same therory is going on inside the pump. If you open up the distance between the vanes you are pumping more flow for each revolution but since the velocity of the fluid has slowed down the resulting pressure wont be as high.

The difference in the two scenarios is surface area and open versus closed system. The surface area inside the pump is fixed and hopefully our coolant systems are closed systems:biglaugh:. The surface area or outlet of the hose changes so the pressure and velocity changes.

Dont be confused by system curves and pump performance curves.

See attached
As throttling occurs in the system the system curve will change but the pump performance curve stays the same. What we did was change the pump curve by removing vanes.
If you increase flow, you can see that the pressure will decrease
If you decrease flow than pressure will go up.

Hope I didnt confuse anyone :rofl_200:

 

[RagingMain]

Update
Just as I had suspected, have the lower number of vanes allowed more flow but less pressure. Going up hills where I had problems before, especially 2up it worked great but sitting in traffic it would over heat.

So I had a custom radiator built. See pics below.
Here is a question for you guys. I have done some searching on the internet and have found a small 5" electric fan. I can mount 2 of them side by side for a total of 630 cfm.

Not sure on the OEM cfm but the fan size is only 6".

I am thinking have 4 more inches of fan and covering more of the radiator will help cooling tremendously. Might actually help with an OEM radiator as well. Isnt a radiator only as good as the air flowing across it, especially at low speed.

What do you guys think???:confused2:

Here is a link to the ones I am looking at
http://www.northernautoparts.com/ProductModelDetail.cfm?ProductModelId=19752

 

[satariel666]

Oh crap brotha, kick my ass couse I didnt saw Your last reply :bang head:

I never gone that far with modifying the cooling system couse im living in the neutral climate. I can feel your pain tho, most time in the year its hot there.

Its very intresting but IMO the whole colling system was designeg to specific
nominal pressure and for nominal flow. Even if You will create the more efficient vane, you will create more flow with even more pressure this could not work.
Thats becouse the whole colling passages in the engine cases have thier max flow with nominal pressure. They will not let you to increse the flow without the limit. And IMHO the v-max flow is already close to limit.
Just my toughts.


I like this bigger rad a lot!
Its ass kickin!
How much did you paid for that beauty?


About the custom fan.
This is another crappy thingy in our mighty v-max.
I saw the fans in modern bikes and I can tell You that v-max fan is not even a half cfm as the modern bikes fans.

Upgrading the fan will surly help you a lot.
Im afraid the theres no much room for two fans.
In those days you can get stock size fan with 3 times more cfm then stock one.

That one posted should do the trick.

You may also try to look at the industry automation colling fans.
I would help you here but im not much acquainted with US market.


Anway thanks for sharing.

 

[RagingMain]

Ok so I had an epiphany last night.
Dont know why I didnt think of this before but one large fan will always out flow 2 small ones.
My main concern last night was covering as much as the radiator as possible and with a very simple equation we all learned in grade school I could have figured this out last night without bother you all.

Area of a circle A=Pi times radius squared.

OEM Fan 6"
(3.14x3x3)= 28.26 sqin

Two 5" fans
(3.14x2.5x2.5)x2= 39.25 sqin

An 11" improvement, not to bad, but....an 8" fan
3.14x4x4 = 50.24 sqin

So like Prezmek said one fan with adequate CFM will do the job better than our OEM

I just thought 2 fans would look cool with the beefy radiator unk:

 

[one2dmax]

I do like the Radiator. I recently got a bigger one myself and have yet to open the box. Wonder how much you had to give?
Sean

 

[Thevmaxrider]

A bigger fan AND bigger rad will help with the 2 main problems with the Vmax cooling system. Those problems are a lack of airflow, even with the fan running, and a lack of cooling system capacity. The coolant passages in the engine are uber efficient at removing heat from the engine, but the radiator is too small and the coolant flows too fast to get enough heat transfer to the air. Geez never thought my thermodynamics course would come in handy:biglaugh: What needs to happen is you need to increase the volume, maintain the flow through the system, and have that volume reside in the radiator to ensure enough time for as much heat transfer as possible. I would like to see the volume increase include more rows of channels for coolant and not just the tanks at the top and bottom. As we know the more surface area created the more heat will be dissipated. Also going to an aluminum rad would be something good as the heat transfer coefficient for aluminum blows steel and brass out of the water.:eusa_dance: