Demo ride reports!

VMAX  Forum

Help Support VMAX Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

RaWarrior

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
3,407
Reaction score
49
Location
Austin, TX
I played hooky from work today to go test drive bikes at Americade today. I know, tough break but someone had to do it. Since it's mid-week, the schedules didn't fill up instantly and I managed to get four rides in today, apart from cruising the vendor expo and other stuff. I wanted to ride the Triumph Speed Triple, but they had some retarded policy that you had to be 21 (all other OEMs were 18) to ride. Oh well. Kawasaki was right next, so I hit there first and booked up a Z1000

'11 Kawi Z1000
It's no understatement that this is the best bike I have ever ridden. WOW. It shines in every area. I was wondering a bit at first since "on paper", it's not really that much more powerful than my Vmax (albeit ~150lbs lighter wet to wet). However, the worry about a lack of power went out the window the instant we set off. Holy powerband, Batman. This thing has mondo torque everywhere, easily beating out my Vmax down low. You can roll on from 1500 in 6th and it smoothly pulls away without so much as a vibration or "jitter" from too much load at low RPM like the Max mill does. There's just gobs and gobs of torque. However, once you get the tach to push past 7 grand, it's like hitting v-boost, except twice as dramatic. I did a roll-on in third, it caught about 7000, there was a huge rush of power and all of a sudden I was looking at the sky...mega power wheelie. On the highway, 6th gear is around 5000 RPM, and at that speed you've got effortless power on tap...puts my Max to shame. Just a tiny crack of the gas pulls you back and sends it north of 100 in an instant. No downshift needed. The guide said he'd had it past 160, which I can definitely believe. The motor is flat out amazing. Massive torque everywhere with screaming power up top. In a light, rock solid chassis(like, it doesn't jiggle when I hit bumps in corners....lol) that handles like a sportbike. All with a comfortable, sport-touring riding posture. Not as "demanding" as a total sportbike, but not on-your-butt cruising either. It's perfect, felt totally in control of the bike all the time. I strongly think the Z1000 will be my next bike.

Yamaha FZ8 (new for '11)
This is in a similar class and aimed as a competitor to the Z...the sporty naked bike. All in all, they're rather similar in size, weight, style, ect. However, the little things were what ended up detracting from the Yam compared to the Z.
First, the top end punch isn't there compared to the Z....which isn't a major surprise, it's an 800 against a 1000. By no means pokey, but it couldn't power the front end up. Low end torque was super super smooth, it felt like an electric motor putting around. Like the Z, low RPM accelerating in top gear was no problemo. It handed very well, I'd say on-par with the Z, no complaints there either.
However, there were some differences. First, the Yam's seat height is noticeably taller. I could flat-foot the Z, needed tippy-toes on the FZ8. Being short, I appreciate a low seat. Also, the actual seat pad on the Yam is much more angled down, so after a couple bumps your nuts end up smashed into the tank from your butt sliding down the seat, the Z's seat is angled, but much less so and my butt didn't slide down it. The Z's seat was also MUCH more comfortable. The Yam's transmission was good, but the Z was better. Like my Vmax, neutral was a bit finicky to grab, where it was ultra easy on the Z. Overall it didn't feel as smooth and confident as the Kawi's. The throttle feel was also a bit strange, when going from "coast" to "accelerate", it always felt like there was a lag from when you twisted the grip to when it started to move....not a big problem, but was a bit weird at first. This is a very solid bike and really scoots along, it also has a big surge of power in the top end, though not as mind-blowing as the Kawi when at WOT.

'11 Star Raider
Rode this in-between the times for the Kawi and FZ8, just for the hell of it. A 1900cc v-twin tourer. Not really my bag, but figured I'd give it a go. First things first....apparently Yamaha still hasn't learned the lesson about putting TINY gauges OUT OF SIGHT. The gauge cluster is low on the tank, as in you need to look at your crotch to see it. The speedometer is huge, the gas gauge is about 1/2 the size of a Vmax tach and in the corner. No tach.

Clutch was surprisingly light, however the motor has ZERO power at idle. I mean, even hinting at letting the clutch off the bar at idle will stall it out. I can get my Vmax rolling with no throttle if I try, or just the tiniest hint the rest of the time. Again, just getting used to a new bike but I thought an enormous V-twin wouldn't need to be revved like a 600 sportbike to get going. First gear is pretty tall, probably why you have to slip the clutch a bit to get moving. Power.....for 1900cc, I wasn't blown away. Vmax would smoke it no effort. There's no tach so I have no idea how fast the motor was going, but just as soon as it started to really pull and get moving....blahblahblahblah rev limiter. Shift, another rush of torque....rev limiter. Guess that's a big v-twin for your. Handling was surprisingly light and nimble given the bike's size....that was impressive. Transmission was good by cruiser standards, much better than the clunky box of rocks on my buddy's M109. Nice bike, if cruisers were my thing I'd buy one.

Last, and definitely least...

'11 Harley XR1200 Sportster. The "XR" is the supposedly "hot" one, with a claimed 90hp and "track day handing", or so says the sales brochure. The one plus to H-D demo rides is they just let you take the bike, you don't have to follow a set route or stay behind a guide in a group. Started it up....and got the typical H-D idle, as in the entire bike shakes like a giant dildo. To be fair, it smooths out almost immediately once you get the revs up, though the mirrors are not terribly useful at any speed. This 1200 V-twin will rev to the stratospheric speed of 7000 rpm, and believe me, you'll need all of it, considering 75mph in top gear is 4500rpm. Yes, it's got very low gearing. No, that doesn't help it be fast. Smashing it in first results in moderately entertaining acceleration until it hits the rev limiter at like 20mph. Then you get second, and it feels like a Vmax in fifth. Bottom line, the acceleration is "adequate" at best and "slow as shit" at worst. I could not get the rear tire to break loose, even going on-off-on snapping the throttle in first. Using the front brake for a burnout is cheating, the motor needs to be able to do it on it's own.
Anyway, so I got going and felt something smacking my foot. It was the shift lever going a wild dance from a combination of loose mounting and the motor's vibration. Since I could do as I please, my first thought was to take it on the highway and see how fast it goes. Romp it up the on ramp and only manage to match highway speed by the end the the ramp. I know my Max will hit 110 in the exact same space, this barely hit 70. Merge onto the highway and twist it to the stop. (Cue Jeopardy music). It rumbles into the 80's, and starts creeping through the 90's. It took exactly 14 seconds to go from 70-100, fifth gear roll on. So much for big v-twin torque. YAWN. Undeterred and determined to get some enjoyment, I kept it pinned and hoped it wouldn't shit the bed in a catastrophic manner. After probably a minute, I had my result....112 mph, which was just shy of redline in fifth. It might hit 120 if you were doing downhill. Though was did really surprise me, it has amazing brakes. Seriously, one finger will slow this thing down like a sportbike. Guess if it can't go, it might as well stop well. I got off the highway and hit a road with a couple quick turns. Garbage. Like a Vmax, only crappier. Doesn't want to lean over, somehow countersteering has virtually no effect, and it wiggled on me when hitting bumps.
But here came the worst part...the trip through gridlock LG village to return this dildo yacht. I never figured out what it was, maybe the oil tank or something, but there's a bit of metal that sticks out on the right side under the seat that gets SCORCHING hot. When you're standing the bike, the back of your thigh can't help but hit it. I was doing a little chicken dance balancing the bike between my left and right foot to avoid the super hot mystery thing. It, of course, shakes like hell, which I found to become very annoying very quick. As the motor (and my legs) heat up from sitting in traffic, the idle got kind of irregular and even shittier than usual, causing it to shake, even more. I got back on my Max after riding that and felt like I was on riding the bike of the gods in comparison. So yeah....it sucks. I can't say I was expecting much from a H-D, my expectations were suitably low going in, and yet I still managed to be disappointed. This was supposedly the up-tuned version of the 1200. I can't imagine what the regular 1200 or....*shudder* the 883 must be like.

On another note, I talked for a while with the guy at the Kymco scooters area. Apparently their demo group was out and was at a stoplight with a couple people on demo HDs. One of them made a comment about the sexual orientation of scooter riders. Once of the "scooters" was the 500R, which will top 100mph and do 60 in under 5 seconds. He dropped it and smoked the HD to the next stoplight....:rofl_200:
So yeah, if you see a Kymco "Xciting R", it's a lot faster than it would appear to be given it's "scooterish" appearance.

Also...ran into and talked for a bit with another Vmaxer. Name was John, said the bike was a '99. Carbon color, some kind of aftermarket pipe, and a big Givi tail bag. NJ plate....anybody here?
 
Ra, great review! You should write a column in cycleworld, or one of the motorcycle rags. No B.S., all straightforward bike comparisons....you're what they need! Agreed that the XR1200 paragraph had me laughing hard!! Thanks for sharing.
 
Thanks , that was more entertaining than a lot of bike mag reviews i have read. Maybe you have a calling....... :rofl_200:
 
Wish you had tried the Ninja 1000. Really liked it at the bike show. I believe it has the same motor as the Z1000 just some bodywork, etc.
 
Good write up. Think I'll skip the xr1200, if I have the oportunity to ride it. Sounds like it has all the qualities of the 1969 xlch I once owned.
 
I don't know what you do for a living but you ought to be writing.....That was most ecelllently informative and more importanltly ENTERTAINING!

Dildo Yacht! Yes!:rofl_200:
 
Last edited:
Yea, I have a 1200 Sportster. Well, I technically own it, a good friend actually has it, rides it, cares for it, I just have it titled to me - a group of friends bought it for him (it's what he wanted) when he was going through a divorce. Once you've experienced any kind of bike with some really hp, a Sportster in any tune will be nothing but a huge disappointment. I will still jump on it and ride it once or twice a year just to check it out - and it reminds me quickly why I prefer my 1200 Vmax. And it's amazing, but he loves it. I guess it's the sound and the look that he's going for. To me, Vmax power is adequate but still lacking, so something like that is just a complete disappointment to ride.

Good reviews RAWarrior - the Z1000 sounds very interesting.
 
Yep, the Ninja 1000 and Z100 have 100% identical motors...actually a 1050cc. The Ninja has more fairings and a somewhat more relaxed position, a bigger gas tank, and overall it weighs a few pounds extra. The Kawi demo guy I was talking with said they're extremely close in 0-60 and 1/4 mi times, with the Z usually edging it out from lighter weight and slightly shorter gearing. From the couple people I asked, top end was knocking on 170, where it hits the rev limiter in 6th. Taller gearing will wind it close to 180 before the motor finally taps out.

Not to be confused with the ZX-10, which has a completely different "track tuned" motor, 998cc. I talked about this for a bit also, and while the Kawi guy said it's a phenomenal bike and the motor is explosive, he said "on the street" the Z would probably be quicker, said if you don't plan on taking it to the track you'll never see the ZX's potential.


In other news, I stopped at Sportline today and they have a leftover '10 Z1000 on the floor for $8800. Out-the-door price was a bit over $9400 and the dealer had some nice financing options. I'm 90% sure I'm going to buy it. My demo ride experience was seriously that good....to make me jump ship the next day.
 
Yep, the Ninja 1000 and Z100 have 100% identical motors...actually a 1050cc. The Ninja has more fairings and a somewhat more relaxed position, a bigger gas tank, and overall it weighs a few pounds extra. The Kawi demo guy I was talking with said they're extremely close in 0-60 and 1/4 mi times, with the Z usually edging it out from lighter weight and slightly shorter gearing. From the couple people I asked, top end was knocking on 170, where it hits the rev limiter in 6th. Taller gearing will wind it close to 180 before the motor finally taps out.

Not to be confused with the ZX-10, which has a completely different "track tuned" motor, 998cc. I talked about this for a bit also, and while the Kawi guy said it's a phenomenal bike and the motor is explosive, he said "on the street" the Z would probably be quicker, said if you don't plan on taking it to the track you'll never see the ZX's potential.


In other news, I stopped at Sportline today and they have a leftover '10 Z1000 on the floor for $8800. Out-the-door price was a bit over $9400 and the dealer had some nice financing options. I'm 90% sure I'm going to buy it. My demo ride experience was seriously that good....to make me jump ship the next day.


i saw the bike on craigslist, good luck with the sale, when i was trying to sell mine last year i wanted to get a z1k
 
Only part of the "Z" that concerns me is,,, Wheelies cost a fortune now... They will even loose your driving privileges all together. I can keep the Max's on the ground and smoking...
 
Only part of the "Z" that concerns me is,,, Wheelies cost a fortune now... They will even loose your driving privileges all together. I can keep the Max's on the ground and smoking...

See, that's always been interesting, I hear so many of you guys talking about how the Vmax will put the tire up in smoke... if my Max is going to do something, it'll pull that front wheel up off the ground and hang it there. I can get a burnout going if I get up on the tank, but normal riding position I don't have traction issues, just hanging the front tire at will. Must be a big guy thing, I keep that rear tire hooked pretty good.

RaWarrior, you have sparked serious interest in the Z1k for me as well... I see a fellow rider every day commuting on one, and it's a cool looking bike, and it sounds like it'll handle and even outrun the max... a possible winning combination.
 
Unless your Vmax has some serious modification, I suspect the Z will smoke it both in the straights and definitely in the corners. It spins about 130hp/72lbs of torque at the tire in bone stock form. From what I've read, an exhaust and power commander will bump that over 140/80. Wet, full of gas ready to ride, it comes in at 480lbs, so it's got a huge weight advantage also.

Light-to-light the Max might still have the edge from weight/ability to put power down, but on the highway or twisties, it'd be no contest.

The best I can say is that the Z felt extremely "confident" in corners, in a way my Max just doesn't. It just wanted to lean and lean and lean and was rock steady through all of it. It isn't unsettled by bumps or cracks in the road...which makes me hesitate to take unfamiliar corners fast on my Max...hitting a frost heave, crack, whatever at a near-peg dragging lean angle seriously "upsets" the bike...as in it makes me poop a little. The Z.....not even a little. Like it's on a rail. The guy in front of me on the demo group was also on a Z, and coming out of a corner he must have been down a couple gears because I saw him power the front end up at probably a 45* angle coming out of the corner. Talk about traction. I didn't go unicycle in the corners, but I gave it a healthy dose and it pulls out of the corner like a freight train...hard enough that I know the Max couldn't, because if I tried the rear end would break loose.

It's a brand new bike with brand new technology, and brand new frame, and suspension right off a sportbike, so I guess it shouldn't be surprising that it outmaneuvers a 25 year old muscle bike. But man, being "used" to the Vmax for 3 years and then stepping onto the Z....man....now I know how Harley riders feel when they ride a Honda.

The FZ1 and FZ8 are surprisingly different. The FZ8 was "from the ground up" a new bike, built as a sport naked. The FZ1 was (and still is) essentially a de-tuned R1 with the fairings chopped a bit. Sitting on the FZ1, it feels much, much more "sportbikey", as in the seat is high, pegs far back, and handlebars very low. The FZ1 has been unchanged for several years, and even looks kind of dated. It would need a serious update to compete with the Z1....the FZ8 is Yamaha's closest competitor, but as I noted it just doesn't "work" as well as the Kawi, at least to me. Not as fast, not as comfortable, throttle feel was a little wonky. Essentially I hopped on the Z and felt "at home" almost instantly, where on the FZ8 at the end of the ride I was still having to "search" for the footpegs and constantly scoot my butt back up the seat since the tank doesn't have a ball-shaped indentation in it.

I've got a Z1000 "on hold" at the local dealer, pending the sale of my Vmax. Even ignoring my review and other typings, that should tell you the most. I was big into my Vmax...had it for going on 3 full seasons. Spent lots of money and got the mods to prove it. I took one 30 minute test-ride at a factory demo event, and the next day have my Max for sale and a Z on standby at the dealer. I had no serious intentions of buying a new bike before riding it. I mean seriously, this bike was that good. It absolutely blew me away.
 
Unless your Vmax has some serious modification, I suspect the Z will smoke it both in the straights and definitely in the corners. It spins about 130hp/72lbs of torque at the tire in bone stock form. From what I've read, an exhaust and power commander will bump that over 140/80. Wet, full of gas ready to ride, it comes in at 480lbs, so it's got a huge weight advantage also.

Light-to-light the Max might still have the edge from weight/ability to put power down, but on the highway or twisties, it'd be no contest.

The best I can say is that the Z felt extremely "confident" in corners, in a way my Max just doesn't. It just wanted to lean and lean and lean and was rock steady through all of it. It isn't unsettled by bumps or cracks in the road...which makes me hesitate to take unfamiliar corners fast on my Max...hitting a frost heave, crack, whatever at a near-peg dragging lean angle seriously "upsets" the bike...as in it makes me poop a little. The Z.....not even a little. Like it's on a rail. The guy in front of me on the demo group was also on a Z, and coming out of a corner he must have been down a couple gears because I saw him power the front end up at probably a 45* angle coming out of the corner. Talk about traction. I didn't go unicycle in the corners, but I gave it a healthy dose and it pulls out of the corner like a freight train...hard enough that I know the Max couldn't, because if I tried the rear end would break loose.

It's a brand new bike with brand new technology, and brand new frame, and suspension right off a sportbike, so I guess it shouldn't be surprising that it outmaneuvers a 25 year old muscle bike. But man, being "used" to the Vmax for 3 years and then stepping onto the Z....man....now I know how Harley riders feel when they ride a Honda.

The FZ1 and FZ8 are surprisingly different. The FZ8 was "from the ground up" a new bike, built as a sport naked. The FZ1 was (and still is) essentially a de-tuned R1 with the fairings chopped a bit. Sitting on the FZ1, it feels much, much more "sportbikey", as in the seat is high, pegs far back, and handlebars very low. The FZ1 has been unchanged for several years, and even looks kind of dated. It would need a serious update to compete with the Z1....the FZ8 is Yamaha's closest competitor, but as I noted it just doesn't "work" as well as the Kawi, at least to me. Not as fast, not as comfortable, throttle feel was a little wonky. Essentially I hopped on the Z and felt "at home" almost instantly, where on the FZ8 at the end of the ride I was still having to "search" for the footpegs and constantly scoot my butt back up the seat since the tank doesn't have a ball-shaped indentation in it.

I've got a Z1000 "on hold" at the local dealer, pending the sale of my Vmax. Even ignoring my review and other typings, that should tell you the most. I was big into my Vmax...had it for going on 3 full seasons. Spent lots of money and got the mods to prove it. I took one 30 minute test-ride at a factory demo event, and the next day have my Max for sale and a Z on standby at the dealer. I had no serious intentions of buying a new bike before riding it. I mean seriously, this bike was that good. It absolutely blew me away.
That's a great thing when a bike can just work in every way you want. I don't think I felt as connected to my Vmax as this year, it really fits me now. I have done a bunch to get to where it's at today but I still think I want to do a little more so I can say Redbone is "finished".
I have been thinking that I might want to get a trail/ street bike because of all the possiblities of great rides in the back woods of the U.P.. I see that at Thunder they will have Yamaha demo rides there so I may just see if I can get a ride on the Tenere, Yamaha's Adventure bike. Although I am wondering if I get a newer bike what would I ride, but a adventure bike is so different that I think it would be easier to own due to it's utility.
 
The Tenere was the first bike to get booked up at the Yamaha demo station, the crew said that and the FZ8 were by far the most popular bikes. If they have demo's make sure to get there early to sign up. I sat on it but didn't ride it (not sure I would want to)....I could just barely touch the ground, like it would be bad news if I came to a stoplight and there was a pothole where my foot would go...I'd tip over like a drunk on a Harley at a stoplight. Really really tippy toes on it...then again I'm only 5-7.

I'm not really sure I get the "adventure" bikes. I guess it's supposed to be an enduro that's more suited for the street, but I can't imagine riding a 600lb bike with 70/30 tires and big, high mounted hard bags on anything more treacherous than a maintained dirt road. A 200lb dirt bike with knobbies, it ain't. But I guess they're popular, since I see them absolutely everywhere. I think the gigantic hard bags are ugly as sin and must be like a sail on the highway, but that's just me.
 
I have never ridden one so I would at least like to try it out. I could see myself and a couple buddy's riding cross country, camping and seeing all the backcounrty roads that I missed while hitting vboost on the roadways. I have always liked the technical aspect of riding offroad but maybe the allure may fade a bit if it becomes a wrestling match between me and a 600 lb bike. The only thing I would worry about would be the performance in loose sand as we have a lot of it around here. I'm 6' which should allow me to flat foot it easy enough once I have the sag set.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top