Hard to start in cold weather

[MaxMidnight]

...you need to start with a full charge, to load-test properly.

...but you need to ensure that any surface charge has been disapated otherwise it is possible to get a spurious result.

 

[02GF74]

It cranks badly only under certain conditions, that happened couple of times. And bike starts, although hardly.

Failing batteries show themselves as bad when being used to turn over an engine in the cold.

It may have been better to wash the cell out with distilled water then top up with acid.

 

[Fire-medic]

Failing batteries show themselves as bad when being used to turn over an engine in the cold.

It may have been better to wash the cell out with distilled water then top up with acid.

I'm no pro on batteries, but my local shop said that re-filling an empty cell with battery acid is not what to-do, when I asked them.

 

[Parminio]

A whole lot of to do over a dead battery. Probably spent more time and energy than the 60 bucks it's worth. And you never fill a used battery with acid. You're just begging for trouble.

The water evaporates, the sulfuric acid does not. Filing with acid can make the mixture too concentrated and cause either a literal melt down or an explosion.

 

[sdt354]

A quick check, if you don't have a load tester . Fully charge the battery, disconnect it, let it sit overnight, it should read a minimum of 12.5 volts in the morning.

 

[putin]

A quick check, if you don't have a load tester . Fully charge the battery, disconnect it, let it sit overnight, it should read a minimum of 12.5 volts in the morning.

Funny, but battery reads and performs good.

 

[putin]

A whole lot of to do over a dead battery. Probably spent more time and energy than the 60 bucks it's worth. And you never fill a used battery with acid. You're just begging for trouble.

The water evaporates, the sulfuric acid does not. Filing with acid can make the mixture too concentrated and cause either a literal melt down or an explosion.

If you have issues, go check another posts. Do not spend you priceless time here. I learned a lot from this discussion, but not from your offensive and useless posts.

 

[Parminio]

It's an opinion. You asked for it by posting here. Sorry you got all butthurt over it.

You constantly changing your story doesn't help matters. Pick one story and stick with it.

 

[MaxMidnight]

If you have issues, go check another posts. Do not spend you priceless time here. I learned a lot from this discussion, but not from your offensive and useless posts.

Am I missing something here?

Mr P offers a warning about a potentially serious issue and you chew his danglies off.

Would you prefer not to get advice that may prevent a serious injury?

 

[Screwloose]

Anyway; my experience with batteries is that in the good old days you could connect a charger in reverse polarity and kick up the sediment inside, empty then refill with new acid and it all works great. Even Scottish tap water worked as a top up on acid! Sadly not in the last 15 years. Modern batteries are nowhere near as robust, if you connect in reverse polarity you will damage at least one cell, if the battery ever drops below about 3V it will probably not recover (chargers with revitalisation mode will not work either) even new acid will not work as the plates are now damaged and the chemical reaction between plates and acid will not function as intended. New battery manufacture is all in the name of the eco system, apparently cost and longevity is not considered. A load tester is the only way I found to test a battery as the battery can hold a voltage for weeks unchanged with it being unconnected and kept at ambient temperature, but put a load on it and the cranking ability collapses. Hope that helps. Its been many years since i’ve studied batteries and its a specialised subject so i’m very brief in places, just trying to help but what it comes down to is treat your modern battery with care or it will collapse and never recover. I’ve got an Odyssy battery in my G1 and abused that more than any battery I’ve ever had, it’s now kaput after 8 years.

 

[Parminio]

Again, the reason filling with new acid works great is because it makes the mixture a lot more highly concentrated.

The down side to that is it makes the battery extra volatile. You'll note that batteries all come with a warning about sparks and flame anywhere near them? That's because they vent oxygen and hydrogen (The two gases to took the Space Shuttle into orbit) as they are charged - in other words while your motor is running. Well, refilling an already used battery with new acid increases that warning by multiple times.

That people get away with it doesn't make it safe. And no amount of "rinsing" or "reverse charging" cures that issue. That's why when batteries are recycled they are completely gutted, the lead re-melted down in secure vats and then reconstructed from brand new materials.

The best way to "take care" of a modern acid filled battery is to do nothing at all to it. Let it die slowly over time, then recharge it on low voltage.

I bought my 2007 Vmax brand new in 2008. I'm on my 3rd battery and it's still running strong.

 

[02GF74]

My earlier suggestion of topping up with acid was on the assumption that the cell was either never filled up or somehow physically emptied.

I'm sure I've bought m/c batteres where the acid was in a separate container in the past, recent laws prohibit posting acid as well as restrict sales.

As for prolonging the lifetime of a lead-acid battery, either disconnect it or keep it fully charged using a trickle charger.

 

[Parminio]

either disconnect it or keep it fully charged using a trickle charger.

The rep from Battery Tender told me the polar opposite. According to him, you're never, ever supposed to leave a tender on full time. It's made to maintain a battery for a few days or a week, not months on end.

You're better off disconnecting the battery and letting it slowly discharge over time, then the day or two before you ride, hooking it back up and letting it charge. The same with boat motors. Just sit the battery on the shelf and the week before boating season starts up throw it on the charger.

Leaving it hooked up full time will slowly boil the water right out of it as it cycles on and off and on and off.

This is directly from the Battery Tender FAQ:

In theory, you can leave the Battery Tender® Plus battery charger connected to a battery forever. That’s a really long time. Sales people like to say, “Just plug it in and forget about it!” However, practically speaking, it is a good idea to check on the battery at least once every couple of weeks.

And

Also consider this. No matter how good a product is, anything can break. In fact, everything will break, eventually. There are only 2 questions to be answered. 1) When will it fail? & more importantly 2) How will it fail?

The entire FAQ is full of nothing but excuses for everything that can go wrong by leaving a Tender connected full time. Most of it leaves what goes wrong "anybody's guess" when the fact of the matter is the Tender will flat out fry batteries more times than not if left connected full time.

That's why it's a categorically bad idea to do it and no actual rep of the company will ever tell you to do that. Only a sales rep looking for a sale will ever suggest "connect it and forget it". Battery Tender tells you that in black and white.

 

[Screwloose]

The rep from Battery Tender told me the polar opposite. According to him, you're never, ever supposed to leave a tender on full time. It's made to maintain a battery for a few days or a week, not months on end.

You're better off disconnecting the battery and letting it slowly discharge over time, then the day or two before you ride, hooking it back up and letting it charge. The same with boat motors. Just sit the battery on the shelf and the week before boating season starts up throw it on the charger.

Leaving it hooked up full time will slowly boil the water right out of it as it cycles on and off and on and off.

This is directly from the Battery Tender FAQ:


And



The entire FAQ is full of nothing but excuses for everything that can go wrong by leaving a Tender connected full time. Most of it leaves what goes wrong "anybody's guess" when the fact of the matter is the Tender will flat out fry batteries more times than not if left connected full time.

That's why it's a categorically bad idea to do it and no actual rep of the company will ever tell you to do that. Only a sales rep looking for a sale will ever suggest "connect it and forget it". Battery Tender tells you that in black and white.

Not charging constantly makes sense to me. I’ve got cars and bikes I put off the road during winter months and always remove the batteries, store them out the bad weather, then give them a trickle charge for a few hours every month or so. They last for many years doing this. My spare battery for jump starting is about 10 years old and is never permanently attached to a load or a trickle charger.

 

[02GF74]

i was referring to the "intelligent" type that will turn off once battery is fully charged so no chance of boiling away the water ...... anyways, I don't have one so do my "trickle" charge by connecting regular chargers ever few months.

which reminds me, is there an easily accessible permanent live wire that connects to +ve battery terminal so I can charge the battery without having to remove the seat?

 

[MaxMidnight]

I'm sure I've bought m/c batteries where the acid was in a separate container in the past, recent laws prohibit posting acid as well as restrict sales.

As for prolonging the lifetime of a lead-acid battery, either disconnect it or keep it fully charged using a trickle charger.

That is correct it is known as a dry charged battery,

This is where a battery is charged, the electrolyte drained and dried out.
The benefit is that they have a longer shelf life and as you say, they can be shipped safely.
If a battery has lost its electrolyte whilst in service then that would suggest there is a problem with it.

When storing a battery it should be kept in a cool place as well.

which reminds me, is there an easily accessible permanent live wire that connects to +ve battery terminal so I can charge the battery without having to remove the seat?

Easyest way to do this is to connect a flying lead to the +ve and -ve poles.
Something like this.

 

[VMAXXIMUM]

i was referring to the "intelligent" type that will turn off once battery is fully charged so no chance of boiling away the water ...... anyways, I don't have one so do my "trickle" charge by connecting regular chargers ever few months.

which reminds me, is there an easily accessible permanent live wire that connects to +ve battery terminal so I can charge the battery without having to remove the seat?
[/
Yes bye a lithium ion battery. Like a Shorai lfx18. They use a digital charger that plugs into the battery so you can leave the cable attached under the seat.

 

[Parminio]

i was referring to the "intelligent" type that will turn off once battery is fully charged so no chance of boiling away the water

That's the point: That is what that text refers to: the intelligent Battery Tender.

The salesman will tell you to do it. No actual rep that works for Battery Tender ever will. They can flat destroy a battery more times than not and when it happens they use plausible deniability and blame the battery.