How did I botch this clutch job?

VMAX  Forum

Help Support VMAX Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

desert_max

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 14, 2010
Messages
1,534
Reaction score
1,253
Location
Chandler, Arizona
Intrepid forum followers might have noted elsewhere that I was doing a clutch in my 86. Guess I was a little too hard on the old girl, but I ordered the clutch packs from Sean and a heavy duty spring.

Before I detail what’s going on, I would just offer up that I have done my share of clutch jobs on various motorcycles and I’m very comfortable with the procedure. Had the disks out of this one a couple of months ago as they were frozen from sitting for 10 years. Did a couple of clutches in my 94 when I had it. So I didn’t expect any Vmax drama. But…

I rode it it onto the lift yesterday under power and pulled the disks out of it pending arrival of the new parts today. The stuff came in and I threw the new discs and spring in today. Happy as a clam I was about to button it up, but as a sanity check squeeze the clutch lever so I could see the action. Imagine my surprise when the lever bottomed out hard after about a half inch of travel! WTF?

At that point, I had not even pulled the top hat or ball out. Had no reason to. For giggles, I did and verified that both the ball and the O-ring on the top hat are intact. They were and they are. Checked the spooge hole in the master cylinder and flushed the system and had the same result. The master cylinder is operating correctly as it bottomed out until pressure built.

I pulled the whole pressure plate off of it and still the lever is rock hard and bottoms after about a half an inch of travel.

The logic in me is saying that I am just the very unlucky recipient of evil coincidence and my slave cylinder has frozen up. Unless somebody can tell me otherwise, I have no recourse but to pull the bastard out and order a rebuild kit. Is that bad luck or what?
 
Last edited:
An internally-collapsed hose? As you said, a frozen slave cyl? I've gone as-far as to remove a caliper on a 1 caliper Honda, to assemble the entire system off the bike, to try and eliminate one at a time, the components to see why I was having problems. I then bench-tested it until I found the bad piece. You'd think you should be able to do it on the bike, but it did show me the problem. Repairing that, and replacing things onto the bike, good to-go. Part of it was logistics, the bike was in one place, and my tools were in another. They don't want you working on vehicles there.

You do know my slave cyl removal/replacement write-up on here? With pics, lotsa-pics.
 
Last edited:
You probably got a good couple of squeezes of no resistance and then it went rock hard. That is what happens when you don't put the pressure plate back on with it clocked correctly. You will have to push the slave back in which might take a bit of work to do and cracking the bleeder will help. Then put it all back together this time lining up the dots on the inner basket (near one of the stanchions) with the dot on the pressure plate (near one of the stanchion holes). All will be good in the world after that.
 
Your consulting fee is in the mail, Sean. Thanks!

Good grief, I did two clutches in my 94 and either was extremely lucky or paid attention to the indexing and had forgotten about it.

Thanks again. Wish I could go out there right now, but have spousal unit obligations today.
 
It has been really hot in Phoenix. Even with a decent swamp cooler in the shop, the temperature approaches 90 degrees in there during the day. (It's 114'ish outside). While that's doable, I think I'm going to wait for a break in the heat... Looks like next weekend will start to see some improvement. I do have the slave cylinder pulled out of it. Have a rebuild kit that I'm going to throw into it anyway. Once I get things back together, I should be back in business.

...and it'll be too dang hot to ride.
 
Okay gents. Tired of waiting for it to cool down in Phoenix. It's obviously not going to do that. We're going to be 110+ for the next 2 weeks. Almost 10° above normal, and our yearly monsoon has turned into a "non soon" this year. The thunderstorm relief from the heat that we usually enjoy between July and October has refused to make an appearance this year.

I am usually pretty handy in the garage, but this clutch is kicking my behind. I pulled the slave and threw a kit in it, pulled out the clutch pack again and confirmed all disks are indexed correctly, reinstalled the pressure plate in the proper orientation hung the new spring...and still have the exact same problem!

Rock hard lever. If I loosen the slave, I can see it moving as it presses on the rod. I can move the loose slave by pushing on the rod from clutch side. But as soon as I secure the slave, it goes rigid.

How can the dang rod move one way but not the other??

I am pulling the whole ugly apart next and rebuild it from scratch. I screwed something up. Funny thing is, I did my '94 without a hitch. Twice. Hmmph
 
Last edited:
Are you sure that the tiny hole closest-to the banjo bolt, in the floor of the master cylinder, is not clogged/obstructed?
 
The hydraulics are working fine. That's what I was referring to when I discussed loosening the slave above. Leaving just a couple of threads engaged allowed me to activate the clutch and see the slave push away from the clutch pack. I can also push it away by pressing the ball/rod from the clutch side. The clutch pack just appears locked. That's my screw-up. I've had it back out twice. I'll be hanged if I can see a problem.
 
I haven’t pulled the rod out, only the ball (which is back in ) so I have no real reason to doubt that everything in the actuator line is correct. It was working perfectly well before I started messing with it. Although as mentioned above, one of my next steps will be to pull that out as well. I didn’t want to disturb the oil seal, but this point need to cover all the bases

I didn’t count friction discs or steels, but I’m 99.9% sure that they are all there and in the correct sequence. I’ve had them out twice since the initial installation. The only thing I changed was the inner half disc adding a full friction disk and removing the half disc accessories.

All discs are lined up with index holes correctly oriented, pressure plate also indexed correctly. What the heck am I missing? I cannot be the only idiot who’s ever screwed this thing up in this manner. I’m just not smart enough to know what it is I screwed up…
 
ok it may be nothing but thought I'd mention it anyway having just fitted new friction plates in my bike of which I followed my Haynes manual,
on the lining up of the two semi circle cut outs in the plates to the two dots on the clutch housing, it says if the clutch plates bind you can reposition them so that the single semi circle cut out edge aligns with the two dots on the housing
 
You know if Julian, I did see a comment about that somewhere. You’re right and I agree, it sounds like a minor deal, but I have nothing else to lose.

And I am starting to get a complex here. I kind of thought this would be a fairly common thing, but I’m beginning to think it’s not and I may be one of the few numnuts who’s encountered it!

Thanks for the observation.
 
Thanks. I know it’s something stupid.

The problem is (at least this is the excuse I’m making) that it is beyond hot in the shop even with the cooler running. Hot doesn’t even describe it. Neither my brain nor my body function well at those obscene levels.

I think I’m going to move somewhere like Brownsville or Naples or Baton Rouge where it’s cool.
 
You have the rod in the correct direction? There is a rounded end (towards the slave) and a flat end (that the ball bearing touches between the two rods).
 
I wish it were that simple, Sean. I never pulled the darn rod out! Thanks. I am going to go out there when the temperature cools off to 105 or so, disassemble the entire clutch line, put it back together and have everything be just fine.

that’s the plan anyway.
 
I think I’m going to move somewhere like Brownsville or Naples or Baton Rouge where it’s cool.


So you are gonna trade heat for heat and humidity, LOL. That humidity is what kills me more than heat. While next door to you we reach triple digits, we dont hit that 110-120 range. And I have been in Phoenix while it was that hot, I know its no joke.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top