Air/fuel ratio meter... again

[adamax]

Anybody used the LM-2 Innovate motorsports air/fuel wide band kit? 559 $ with bells and whistles
Some threads vote positively towards the older LM-1 ( 379 $ on fleabay with rpm signal cable)
Looked at Dynojet wideband commander too :ummm: but felt more at ease with the Innovate ( maybe just a feeling ? )

Any input is appreciated

 

[gamorg02]

mark (birdoprey) has a LM-1 i believe that fargo (ragingman) has

 

[RagingMain]

mark (birdoprey) has a LM-1 i believe that fargo (ragingman) has

That is an outright lie!!! :biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh:
I would never keep another mans tools for months on end and play and play and play and try to achieve the ultimate carb setup.:biglaugh:

Yes I have it and no it is not for permanent setup. Depends on what you are looking for.
If you are looking for just tuning it is awesome. To have strapped to the bike at all times, forget it.

 

[adamax]

I read other posts so I figured some history who gots what :rofl_200:
I have no intention to keep it permanently on the bike, just for tuning only, I even think I hook it to the tailpipe using a suitable fixture during the process.
I just read a lot of negative comments on their forum but this could be because of some specific setups :confused2:
It is a lot of $$ but priceless if working properly.

Feedback is highly appreciated...

 

[dannymax]

Good price for the LM-1

http://www.titanmotorsports.com/lmdiairame.html?gclid=CJr6ieiq7J0CFYdd5QodFQsfLA

 

[one2dmax]

Not sure what the retail is on the dynojet unit but I would sell it for very close to dealer cost if someone was interested. Usually about 25-35% under retail.

Sean

 

[tugla]

sean, haven't i read somewhere on the forum that when setting the a/f mixture that the vmax runs better a little lean? am i remembering correctly, set up about where would be right?

 

[gamorg02]

man there's a lot of options out here. i'm gonna be watching this thread carefully.

i was looking at this as well ($50 cheaper):
http://tunertools.com/proddetail.asp?prod=IN-3795

whats the difference b/t the LM-1?

Looks like the dynojet unit is about $530 retail:
http://www.widebandcommander.com/productinfo.htm

so sean would your price be $375 - $400 ish?

 

[tugla]

hey garrett have you found any that have 4 O2 sensors,it should be lot better to have one in each pipe for tuning, but guess one at the end will do it seems.

 

[dannymax]

Allright...let me get my Nomex suit on here and ask a question:

For a run of the mill stock, or nearly stock (with pipes & shimmed needles), street bike....driven normally, isn't one of the following methods of A/F setting acceptable?

-Set by ear
-All 4 set the same, 2 1/2 - 4 out, determined by driving
-Set by individual cylinder head temp

I really wonder if I would gain enough to justify spending this kind of money, or are we getting into the 'perfectionist' area?

OK, light me up.........:flamethrower:

 

[gamorg02]

hey garrett have you found any that have 4 O2 sensors,it should be lot better to have one in each pipe for tuning, but guess one at the end will do it seems.

i'm going to have a bung in each pipe and use it to set the a/f mixture screw. aside from that they *should* all be the same as far as needle/paj/main tuning so can just use it on one and verify from there. any differences, if there are some, shoudl stay consistent between the front cylinders vs the rear cylinders.

 

[gamorg02]

Allright...let me get my Nomex suit on here and ask a question:

For a run of the mill stock, or nearly stock (with pipes & shimmed needles), street bike....driven normally, isn't one of the following methods of A/F setting acceptable?

-Set by ear
-All 4 set the same, 2 1/2 - 4 out, determined by driving
-Set by individual cylinder head temp

I really wonder if I would gain enough to justify spending this kind of money, or are we getting into the 'perfectionist' area?

OK, light me up.........:flamethrower:

i know on my bike my rears and fronts were about 2 turns apart to get it right around 13/14:1. you could HEAR the engine jump from about 1k rpms to 1600 rpms when it got set right.

i'd say maybe borderline perfectionist? but remember the a/f mixture screws account for a lot of low end. plus i think iv'e heard up near 10% of top end mixture with the mains at 90%

 

[tugla]

ya for sure, guess these ones you found are nice you can mount them and drive with them, set up a bung at the rear of a 4 to 1 system and get a avg after the initial tune up ey.

 

[gamorg02]

yea I have a 4-2, so i may actually do 6 bungs, but we'll see.

 

[one2dmax]

man there's a lot of options out here. i'm gonna be watching this thread carefully.

i was looking at this as well ($50 cheaper):
http://tunertools.com/proddetail.asp?prod=IN-3795

whats the difference b/t the LM-1?

Looks like the dynojet unit is about $530 retail:
http://www.widebandcommander.com/productinfo.htm

so sean would your price be $375 - $400 ish?

Called and the price by the time we count shipping to me and back out you are looking at $390-400 with shipping. Typically I try to sell most items for around 15-20% off retail so i make 10%. Some items I don't even make that much but it's all good. In this case the actual dealer is $349 not counting the shipping to me.

Though I have never tried using one I know the "ideal" tuning method I have always heard about is using the EGT (Exhaust Gas Temperature) method. They have 4 guage meters and 4 sensors for each pipe. Slick stuff and is how the factory sets up the A/F screws when new (ever wondered what the 4 bolt headed plugs were in your stock pipes were for - now you know).

Sean

 

[adamax]

unk:Aha, now we are talking business

To be honest, IMHO and what I read on the Innovate web site, I felt it is easier to use and covers a lot of features, I can use it for my bike or for my car. I looked at the Dynojet wideband commander and I could not get exactly all what it can do ( could be just me ) :confused2: Sean could probably enlighten us with the features :worthy:

I feel that anyone of us even with little technical background should use a reasonable priced device to help him tune his bike properly.

I did not go with the wideband gauge only setup cause I feel it is too expensive for the features ( only A/F ratio ), besides I cannot ride with an eye on the A/F gauge, the other on the tachometer, I rather pay double the amount and get all bells and whistles....

 

[tugla]

Called and the price by the time we count shipping to me and back out you are looking at $390-400 with shipping. Typically I try to sell most items for around 15-20% off retail so i make 10%. Some items I don't even make that much but it's all good. In this case the actual dealer is $349 not counting the shipping to me.

Though I have never tried using one I know the "ideal" tuning method I have always heard about is using the EGT (Exhaust Gas Temperature) method. They have 4 guage meters and 4 sensors for each pipe. Slick stuff and is how the factory sets up the A/F screws when new (ever wondered what the 4 bolt headed plugs were in your stock pipes were for - now you know).

Sean

just like we do car motors on the dyno, egt in each header, super accurate.

 

[one2dmax]

I can't give you a breakdown of everything it will do for you but I know it will do a lot. Feel free to give dynojet a call and ask them about it. Just don't say anything about the deal you might be getting.

Sean

 

[gamorg02]

unk:Aha, now we are talking business

To be honest, IMHO and what I read on the Innovate web site, I felt it is easier to use and covers a lot of features, I can use it for my bike or for my car. I looked at the Dynojet wideband commander and I could not get exactly all what it can do ( could be just me ) :confused2: Sean could probably enlighten us with the features :worthy:

I feel that anyone of us even with little technical background should use a reasonable priced device to help him tune his bike properly.

I did not go with the wideband gauge only setup cause I feel it is too expensive for the features ( only A/F ratio ), besides I cannot ride with an eye on the A/F gauge, the other on the tachometer, I rather pay double the amount and get all bells and whistles....

LM-1 is still wideband. from what i've read we want to go wide-band as the narrow band isn't exact enough to tune with.

 

[adamax]

It is all hard-earned money, I agree, I might calculating it wrong ( feel free to discuss ) but I see it about 5-7% of the cost of the bike ensuring it rides right, or about 30% of the cost of the exhaust system, carb kit and filter to help it running right - not only at idle, but at other operating ranges too. The maximum I could think about is the kit with dual O2 sensors, but for street use I guess it is satisfactorily doable with a single sensor setup, regardless of the brand.
Couldn't the a/f and rpm recordings indicate if we need to drop the needles or go higher on the mains, etc... ( I never used a/f ratio before to tune ) but I assume. ( again, please advise if I assumed wrong, I might just be too optimistic )...