creaking for rear end with new mods

[gamorg02]

cool you got it sorted so there's no point me detailing the axle arrangement from my sample one at work.

Welding stuff creates distortion, it's just the nature of the beast it can't always be totally eliminated. Once you get it tweaked back into shape you'll be fine:eusa_dance:

nah man but i appreciate the help. i was getting frustrated but glad i narrowed it down.

on another interesting note i found the damn needle bearing seal. it had worked itself onto the final drive collar that the axle touches. it was on the 1/8-1/4" of it that protrudes into the wheel area. hiding like a sombitch.

 

[satariel666]

I remember the same problem that I and my friend have long time ago with old honda shadow swingarm.
After welding the swingarm for custom wide tyre swingarm becomes warped a little.

Shadow wheel is very similar to v-max wheel, all of the shaft driven motorcycles runs very similar setup.
Two bearings in the hub, one ball bearing and one neddle bearing.

Problem was similar that Steve described.
The shadow owner toast 2 bearings within 3k miles.

We slolve the problem with copper washer beteween the swingarm/diff surface.
Of course it was pain in the ass to fabricate that washer.

But...owner toasted the ball bearing twice. He didnt have any sounds in that wheel. Just a very short life to the ball bearing. neaddle was suprisly fine.

 

[gamorg02]

I remember the same problem that I and my friend have long time ago with old honda shadow swingarm.
After welding the swingarm for custom wide tyre swingarm becomes warped a little.

Shadow wheel is very similar to v-max wheel, all of the shaft driven motorcycles runs very similar setup.
Two bearings in the hub, one ball bearing and one neddle bearing.

Problem was similar that Steve described.
The shadow owner toast 2 bearings within 3k miles.

We slolve the problem with copper washer beteween the swingarm/diff surface.
Of course it was pain in the ass to fabricate that washer.

But...owner toasted the ball bearing twice. He didnt have any sounds in that wheel. Just a very short life to the ball bearing. neaddle was suprisly fine.

i think 4 copper washers with varying thickness around each of the final drive studs b/t that and the swingarm would probably work. the problem being, machining them correctly and then allowing dirt and grime in there. you are then 1mm off on how much the shaft engages but not sure if that would cause any problems.

i have a new ball bearing and needle bearing coming, i'm not sure if i'm going to put new ones in or not. if it doesn't creak when its alligned right its probably fine, yes? probably 400 miles on these bearings.

 

[tugla]

how thick of a copper washer you need garrett? i got a few here from electrical stuff

 

[one2dmax]

in your case the problem is not forward or aft. it's up and down. We did not alter the length of the arm at all. So, that's why you can get the first shock on easy but the second shock is a fight.

Sean

 

[gamorg02]

how thick of a copper washer you need garrett? i got a few here from electrical stuff

i appreciate the help man but its going back to sean to get fixed properly. the final drive doesn't sit flush on the swingarm when it sits even with the axle so if someone was to do that they'd need 4 different thicknesses which probably could only be determined by trial and error. plus thats not really a fix, more of a bandaid..

 

[gamorg02]

in your case the problem is not forward or aft. it's up and down. We did not alter the length of the arm at all. So, that's why you can get the first shock on easy but the second shock is a fight.

Sean

yyup, i think the shaft side is too high. makes sense the distance seemed too short when the final drive was bolted in right, and when it was finger tight there was a 1mm gap on top and nothing on the bottom.

oh one other thing i was going to mention, on a stock swingarm installed along with the driveshaft you can take the end of the driveshaft sticking out and move it all long the inside of the swingarm. i couldn't do that on the inside side, thats due to the notching right?

 

[dannymax]

i think 4 copper washers with varying thickness around each of the final drive studs b/t that and the swingarm would probably work. the problem being, machining them correctly and then allowing dirt and grime in there. you are then 1mm off on how much the shaft engages but not sure if that would cause any problems.

i have a new ball bearing and needle bearing coming, i'm not sure if i'm going to put new ones in or not. if it doesn't creak when its alligned right its probably fine, yes? probably 400 miles on these bearings.

Think I'd start with a clean slate Garrett, might be a waste of money but then again... some needles fell out of the cage...don't think that's normal...plus Przemek mentioned a guy with this issue and it destroyed his bearings quickly. JMHO:worthy:

 

[[email protected]]

think i'd start with a clean slate garrett, might be a waste of money but then again... Some needles fell out of the cage...don't think that's normal...plus przemek mentioned a guy with this issue and it destroyed his bearings quickly. Jmho:worthy:

+1....

 

[one2dmax]

The notch removes the movement to the inboard when comparing play of the driveshaft.

 

[satariel666]

i have a new ball bearing and needle bearing coming, i'm not sure if i'm going to put new ones in or not. if it doesn't creak when its alligned right its probably fine, yes? probably 400 miles on these bearings.

I cant tell for sure without seeing the patient.
There're at least dozen things that may be not ok.
Jedi pointed You in right direction.
However that may not be the end.

All I can say that after seeing the inner race...and now You know what I will say.

 

[gamorg02]

The notch removes the movement to the inboard when comparing play of the driveshaft.

makes sense to me.

when i re-pounded in the needle bearing a couple of the bearings fell out, do you think that warrants putting a brand new one in? how about a ball bearing on the brake side?

I cant tell for sure without seeing the patient.
There're at least dozen things that may be not ok.
Jedi pointed You in right direction.
However that may not be the end.

All I can say that after seeing the inner race...and now You know what I will say.

you think the inner race/bearing and ball bearing should be replaced?

 

[gamorg02]

so an update. sean found the shaft side of the arm up about 3/8". he fixed that and i got it back. (fast shipping, great service as usual)

the problem is no better or worse. same as before

if i loosen the acorn nuts to finger tight, all noises stop, but once they're tightened down, creaking.

i'm gonna try out and have definitive proof if my old wheel creaks with this arm. that should point in one direction of another for sure.

sean mentioned maybe somehow the final drive flange on the swingarm might not be true, and could be causing issues. could be worth a check, not sure how to tho.

 

[dannymax]

so an update. sean found the shaft side of the arm up about 3/8". he fixed that and i got it back. (fast shipping, great service as usual)

the problem is no better or worse. same as before

if i loosen the acorn nuts to finger tight, all noises stop, but once they're tightened down, creaking.

i'm gonna try out and have definitive proof if my old wheel creaks with this arm. that should point in one direction of another for sure.

sean mentioned maybe somehow the final drive flange on the swingarm might not be true, and could be causing issues. could be worth a check, not sure how to tho.

Sorry to hear this Garrett. Could you use your dial indicator on the wheel bead, tighten the acorn nuts and see if that pulls the wheel one way or the other? :confused2:

 

[gamorg02]

Sorry to hear this Garrett. Could you use your dial indicator on the wheel bead, tighten the acorn nuts and see if that pulls the wheel one way or the other? :confused2:

something to think about but i think just tightening it up may throw the indicator off to get a good reading b/t the two times.

i was thinking more get the shaft part of the swingarm parallel and then see if the flange is perpendicular using a good level. then compare it to my stock one, see how much its 'parallel' is 'off'

 

[gamorg02]

can someone or a couple people do me a favor throw your bike on the CS and loosen the 4 acorn nuts on the f/d and then put them on finger tight. do the two surfaces (final drive and swingarm) mate perfectly or is there a gap on one side or something? the top of mine still has a small (i'd say .5mm) gap whereas the bottom is touching..

Thanks!


also thinking of seeing what these guys have to say: http://computra.startlogic.com/default.htm

 

[95spfldmax]

Geez, Garrett......

Bummed to hear your still chasing this thing...........

 

[satariel666]

can someone or a couple people do me a favor throw your bike on the CS and loosen the 4 acorn nuts on the f/d and then put them on finger tight. do the two surfaces (final drive and swingarm) mate perfectly or is there a gap on one side or something? the top of mine still has a small (i'd say .5mm) gap whereas the bottom is touching..

Thanks!


also thinking of seeing what these guys have to say: http://computra.startlogic.com/default.htm

As far with my findings theres always a gap, not regular one.

 

[gamorg02]

can someone or a couple people do me a favor throw your bike on the CS and loosen the 4 acorn nuts on the f/d and then put them on finger tight. do t

As far with my findings theres always a gap, not regular one.

Can you re-phrase przemek?

 

[satariel666]

Can you re-phrase przemek?

Im saying that theres always an non regular gap beteween driveshaft housing and the swingarm when You will lose the acorn nuts.