My newest problems

[89max]

So last summer I was having some hard starting issues, as well as multiple random fuel rrlated issues. So this winter I tore all 4 carbs completely apart, cleaned everything, replaced parts, set dry float levels, and reassembled. This spring I had very minor, very occasional starting problems, but once it started and warmed up, it ran better than ever.

Until Sunday night. I rode to the local Honda (car) dealership, where my buddy is a service manager. He was using the garage to adjust the valves in his CBR. While he was torn into it, he wanted to sync his throttle bodies, so he wanted to use my carbtune. Since i had it there, I decided to re check mine. Started the max, rode it into the garage, checked my carbs (which were barely off), adjusted them a bit, and shut it off. Stayed another ~1.5 hrs, went to leave, wouldnt start.

I pulled the plugs, they looked good. Tried and tried and tried, no dice. Finally, at 11:30 pm, I gave up on it and called for a ride home. Hauled it home in a pickup the next day. I have checked and confirmed : spark, fuel pump, drained bowls and they refilled, measured resistance in pickup coil, COP's, cleaned plugs, everything I can think of. Every once in a while I get a few hits, but not enough to keep it running. Ive also gotten a few ear shattering backfires. But it will not start. Im out of ideas. Im lost.

Sorry for the long post, but like I said, Im completely lost. Any ideas?

 

[jedi-]

I remember getting some advice once from a woman would you believe, from a lawnmower shop that said "you only need 3 things to make an engine run, compression, fuel and ignition" that advice stayed with me ever since.

One would have to assume your compression was or is ok that eliminates 1 factor.
So that really leaves fuel or ignition only. Are the plugs all firing everytime outside the bike? Do they get wet if installed? If they remain dry yet were sparking then you probably assume fuel being a problem, you could spray some engine starter around the air filter and see what's happening if it wants to fire.
If the plugs are constantly getting wet then you might assume fuels getting in but maybe there's an electrical issue even ECU, coils etc.

 

[grimmie]

I had a battery a few years ago that would turn the motor over but would not start. If I jumped it with a jump box it would fire right off. If the coils don't get enough volts it won't start.

Just a thought......

 

[89max]

Plugs barely get wet. It is sparking every time every cylinder. Since the plugs are just barely getting wet, i figured cuel.

The battery is only days old. I actually had just filled it and had it on trickle charge at home the night it died. After I hauled it home, the first thing I did was change the battery.

 

[naughtyG]

- can you measure the voltage across the battery poles while cranking?

If it drops too far it may be a dodgy battery - not unheard of even when brand new.

- check/clean both your ignition key switch and starter button/killswitch assemblies.

Sometimes dirt and/or bad contacts can wreak havoc.

- there's a tiny little relay hiding behind the left scoop (and behind the panel that holds blinkers relay and vboost controller) that has to do with killing the motor whenever the side stand is down, the clutch lever is released and the tranny's not in neutral. I've heard of that relay failing, and it could be your problem.

- have you tried squirting a little gas in each pot while you have the spark plugs off?

If that helps it go it would point at a fuel starvation problem.

- how recent is your Rectifier/Regulator?

When these blow they can do silly things to the electrics that'll stop Max from starting. Also may be a good idea to remove it anyway, and give its back and the mating surface on the footpeg support a good clean to make sure of the electrical connection. Even add dialectric grease if you have.

- do you know anyone else with a 85-89 Max near you?

The only way to see if your TCI is playing up (common fault) is to swap it for one known to work. If no-one can help, ask Sean Morley he may be able to lend you one.

 

[89max]

Well, i have not measured cranking voltage. I was just taking for granted that the new battery is good. Ill check that out tonight. The starter cutout relay and ignition switches are another thing Ill check out tonight. My r/r and stator went south last summer, I replaced both with slightly used units from Bill Kratz. around July of last year. I should ohm out the rectifier too i guess.

I only ever see one other VMax parked in my town from time to time, but Ive never had a chance to meet him, so Idoubt he'd me loan his tci lol. Is there any kind test I could try on it myself, resistance or anything?

 

[bazwell]

My 2 cents after reading all this.
Agreed all along, basically.
Jump start her off a running car. That should eliminate some battery faults.
Jedi's comment is true and what I work to. If it's got those 3, it should fire.
If it cranks OK, has some fuel (or starter fluid), and nice fat regular spark, it will fire.

Unless the timing is way off, in which case you might get an almighty bang every now and then. Which would be TCI or maybe pickups.

The most recently changed item = battery. Therefore suspect.
From description, it's the TCI maybe. Hard to diagnose without a know good unit.

 

[89max]

Well one reason im leaning away from battery is that the no start happened before I changed the battery. Put new battery in, no difference. Ill still check it out though. The night it died, at the dealership, from cranking so much it obviously was drained, so we hooked a jump box to it, no difference.

I measured resistance in the pickup coil last night but forgot to add that some values were a little high. I want to get a different meter and check it though, because my meter was acting funny the whole time. I guesz i need to start digging deeper into the pickup and tci next.

 

[gamorg02]

+1 on a car just to be 100% sure its not the battery(s) causing the issue. weirder thigns have happened.

maybe the R&R is shot and its frying batteries? thats reaching but just brainstorming

 

[89max]

Ill try jumping it off my jeep tonight just to rule it out. Then ill check the r/r. I have a guy at work telling me to takethe exhaust off, it may be plugged. I really dont think so, but Im about ready to try anything at this point.

 

[jfeagins]

YOUR EXHAUST IS NOT PLUGGED UP. Tell the guy at work to stick to his own bike.

I had this same issue, and when mine did it, it was a voltage issue when the bike was cooler, and usually first thing in the mornings. I'd give up trying to start it and drive the car to work instead. In the afternoon, when things were much warmer, the bike would fire right off.

I improved the connections between my r/r to the battery and also it's ground connection to the frame. At the same time, I modded the battery box to fit a larger battery. This together, somehow fixed my issues, and it's never been a problem since.

For my problem, I guess, a cold bike requires a bit more voltage to crank vs less voltage to crank it when warmer. While experiencing this issue, my bike would always fire up IF I had time to push it down the drive and bypass the starter motor. aka plenty of voltage for the black box, but not enough voltage to spin the starter at the same time supply the black box for ignition.

Oh, and by the way - I learned it takes three things to make an engine run too, but the way I learned it was:

1. fuel
2. ignition
3. OXYGEN

 

[gamorg02]

unless a rat crawled in there and died i doubt your exhaust is plugged.

 

[89max]

Yeah I'm forgetting the exhaust recommendation. I'm gonna stop on my way home from work and buy a new set of plugs. Just to be sure. Can anyone tell me the proper NGK number I should get? I have COP's and Gannon's resistor harnesses. Is there any different plugs I should get other than stock?

 

[DMAN999]

I just Installed that COPS Kit and it came with teh Stock NGK DPR8EA-9 Plugs.
It did state that they needed to be Gapped to .026 though.

 

[89max]

Ok thanks. Ill let everyone know what happens.

 

[89max]

So I changed the plugs this morning. Hooked the coils back up, and it fired off in half a revolution. Gonna get a shower now then head out for a short ride and see how it runs.

 

[89max]

Went for about a 60 mile ride. Stopped twice along the way and it started right back up each time. Now Ill go out in the morning and see how it acts when its cold. May be in the clear?